Brian Curee: 0:01

All right, well, welcome back to the Mindful Bytes podcast. Today we're actually going to step back a little bit and we're going to talk about it's kind of old news, but I think it's still important for us to talk about going forward. But today we're going to talk about the TikTok blackout. Let's go ahead and introduce the crew. So I'm Brian, the Gen X business leader, and I want to go ahead and say our non-technical Xenial Shana. You know that dinosaur lady. She's napping downstairs right now, so she won't be joining us today.

Olivia Yetman: 0:39

And I'm Olivia, your social media obsessed, millennial. And I'm Ashton Curie, your social media obsessed, millennial.

Ashton Curee: 0:45

And I'm Ashton Kuri. Your oh what am I? Gen Z gadget fanatic. That's what I am.

Brian Curee: 0:58

Say that three times fast.

Olivia Yetman: 1:01

Olivia, you've got to be excited about this topic today because I know you're a huge fan of TikTok right, I am. It is my favorite platform out of all of them.

Brian Curee: 1:08

Well, okay. So, knowing that, I want to ask you back on January 19th. It's a date that I think has been marked in history.

Olivia Yetman: 1:17

I'm already crying.

Brian Curee: 1:20

What was your initial reaction when it went black?

Olivia Yetman: 1:24

What was your initial reaction when it went black? I wanted to take my phone and throw it and shatter it.

Brian Curee: 1:34

Oh my gosh, I hope you, like, had an Android, not an iPhone, right?

Olivia Yetman: 1:38

No, I have an iPhone, Okay. So the funny thing is my niece and nephew, who are teenagers, they like snapchatted me right away and my niece was like, let's go protest in the street. This is how serious it got.

Brian Curee: 2:01

It got really serious fast. How about you Like, how big of a deal was it for you?

Ashton Curee: 2:07

it. I'm not on tiktok, so it wasn't a big deal. You see, I have shorts, I have youtube shorts and I have whatever reddit calls their short form. That's all I need I'll check this out.

Brian Curee: 2:19

Hold on, guys, guys look, oh, I've got shorts too oh gosh I sent him out for that too. Yeah, you did you really did uh, okay, so you don't use tiktok. Uh, uh, I don't use it. You know, I know I used a little bit, but then I got off of it. But I, I have to admit and I want to ask you your thoughts, olivia, on this too, because this is your area I was surprised by how people react. Were you surprised? I was too.

Olivia Yetman: 2:55

I was surprised in that it actually, like I said, niece who you know doesn't really care about anything was ready to go into the street, like this is something that they look at as like a cause to be fought, and so I, yeah, was very surprised by all of that, for sure, but I know Zuckerberg was probably pretty thrilled.

Brian Curee: 3:31

Well, you know, I want to talk about that for a second too, because I think that's what really surprised me as well, was how people were reacting. Now, I had no doubt.

Ashton Curee: 3:42

Can I interject one little question before we?

Brian Curee: 3:45

get too far in.

Ashton Curee: 3:46

Yeah. Why do you think people reacted that way? Was it because they thought it was an injustice to the company? Or do you think it was more a convenience thing, because for me I look at it as like I could just go watch a YouTube short. I can just go to an Instagram reel. Is it because their algorithm is so much better? Or what do you think was the reason why people are so passionate about it?

Olivia Yetman: 4:13

That's a really great question. I personally and I'm very much also in Instagram and on Facebook still, you know, use all the platforms. Basically, I still TikTok is my number one, and it probably is because of the algorithm and you know the things that I'm seeing, but also it just feels more real to me, like honestly, um, where I feel like even reels are a little too polished, um, so yeah, that's that's why I love tiktok. You learn so much on there do you think that?

Brian Curee: 4:57

do you think you look at it differently because of being a social media consultant and coach?

Olivia Yetman: 5:05

I don't think I do, and the reason why is because that's why I do think people were outraged, right, because the same thing like anyone could go on Instagram, right, but it's not TikTok. So there is something to that, the way that community is built on the platform and, you know, like those types of things. And also it was a huge thing for creators, which we. That's a whole different.

Brian Curee: 5:39

Yeah, we're going to get there, yeah, yeah, we're going to get there for sure, get there, yeah. Yeah, we're gonna get there for sure. Well, you know, I think that when, when it all happened, what really concerned me more than anything was because, you know, we're in digital, we're in different platforms, uh, we're gonna talk about some of that least stuff. For sure, we're gonna get to that, uh. But one of the things is it took me back to first off, back to college, and I had a cybersecurity class and I am no cybersecurity expert, so let me go ahead and just put that out there. I mean, I just show you my, I just showed everybody my shorts profile and not everybody's probably following me. It's probably security risk.

Brian Curee: 6:22

But, with all joking aside, I, back in college and this was in 2008, I realized, wow, the cybersecurity threat was a lot different, like to see and learn about the attacks that was happening and that's kind of like the forefront of like future wars and stuff, and you can't. It was hard for me to wrap my mind around it then. But now, fast forward to 2025, I'm like, okay, cybersecurity is definitely a real thing. But I was shocked more than anything. I wasn't as concerned as much, honestly, about the threats, because I don't understand it and maybe one day we'll get somebody on here to help us understand that.

Brian Curee: 6:59

But I was shocked more than anything about how a single app can have that much of an impact on people, because I was seeing videos on. A lot of people went to X. I was seeing videos on that. There were things on Facebook and on Reels. There was people breaking down and crying. There was people that were very angry because they felt like their freedoms were being taken away. But what, what I don't know if. If you know this, olivia, but you know there's a lot of our apps like. I was even reading an article that about from cnn I believe it's cnn business about how china has blocked most of our apps. Already. They've been blocked blocked because we don't want to follow their data stuff, their data security policies. I think they blocked Google, youtube X, facebook, instagram, whatsapp. No.

Ashton Curee: 7:58

They have all their own versions. Yeah, they have all their own versions of it.

Brian Curee: 8:02

So there's a real threat there. But what concerns me when I think of cybersecurity is that, ashton, if you probably remember this, we visited Washington DC and we went to a spy museum. Do you remember that?

Ashton Curee: 8:20

I do remember this. I remember this very vividly.

Brian Curee: 8:22

You do, and it was so interesting, olivia, I don't know. I mean, I don't know how much you know about like history stuff I don't know a lot about history stuff either, but it was cool to go to the spy museum. But the spies especially in Germany, propaganda was a huge weapon that they used to misinform the people of what was really going on. And I thought when I saw this and the things happening like the app and people saying like they're taking your freedoms away, and to know that China doesn't allow our apps there but they're kind of pushing the agenda of our freedoms are being taken away here I'm like that's kind of dangerous. That's a concern I had. I was like, yeesh, that's like I could see that propaganda coming either way. So I don't know the answers. I know this is not a political podcast at all and thank God for that, but it's just like the cybersecurity is real on so many different levels. So what are your thoughts about those type of things? Olivia? Have you thought about that? Ashton, have you thought about that?

Olivia Yetman: 9:25

Those type of things. Olivia, have you thought about that? Ashton, have you thought about that? Yeah, well, I like those are great points that you brought up, which is funny because people think like country right, so they control all their media, because they only put to just at the snap of a finger which we'll probably get into what actually really happened. But I don't believe that Facebook or X or anyone else is any more safe than TikTok, and there's a reason why Meta has different restrictions in Europe than they do here in the US. So I think that TikTok has kind of turned into the target because no company has been able to emulate their app as well.

Brian Curee: 10:47

So, yeah, so I think that. So one of the things that I want to point out that what you're talking about here too, olivia, is something I learned back in my college days in the cybersecurity class that I had was to learn that the, the key here, is that when your data, like, for instance, the data here that they're collecting, who knows what they're doing with that? But they have to abide by the US laws. A foreign country does not have to, which that's where the, from my understanding, that's where the security risk comes in, because they can do whatever they want to with it because they're outside of our country. It was kind of concerning to me back then. I think it was like I said it was 2008.

Ashton Curee: 11:35

It was with.

Brian Curee: 11:35

Google back then, yeah, back then Google like they moved. When all this was being learned, I found out that Google had set up servers that were in another country. I'm like that's kind of scary, but I was just reading the article that, because of China refusing to do these things with Google, google didn't like the way that they wouldn't say, hey, we're going to handle the data this way. They actually moved all their servers back. I read I was like, oh interesting. So there are like I guess that's where I'm trying to help educate myself as well on that Like what, what are these? What are the concerns? I don't know what those are, but I also thought, like if, if the government because I mean the whole idea of like well, this was taken away, I get that, but I also wonder how would people feel if they they found out that we knew that there was a security risk and there could be high risk and they decided not to take it away, and then everybody found out. Would it be?

Ashton Curee: 12:40

that's yeah. So that's what's interesting is that's like the difference in America and China is China protects itself by blocking that stuff, and you know they're protecting their own goals. But here we were built on freedom and so because of that, I think a better action would be trying to inform of the American people of what threats there are, versus just trying to outright block it because it does walk that line of okay, if you're allowed to block this app because it's a security threat, uh, what else can be a security threat? You know, yeah. So yeah, where is that line of do you just inform your people? Do you? You know? Do you go so far as to block it? And then that's a slippery slope. Where do you stop blocking things? If it's a security risk to the government but not to us, then at what point do they become too controlling into what China is?

Brian Curee: 13:52

Yeah, does anybody know any facts that they've read about why they blocked it? I remember at first what they made it where government employees couldn't use it, which I'm like okay, that makes sense. And I can see what you're saying here too, Ashton, about informing people. But where is the line Like, hey, we're going to take it down, we're going to block it?

Brian Curee: 14:07

I mean they did give them warnings and we could still see it go away again. Though I did just read and I'm sure, olivia, you probably already know this, since you're a TikToker and you're just not TikTok just won't stop right.

Ashton Curee: 14:22

Who said that?

Brian Curee: 14:22

condescending. You're a TikToker, you're a TikToker, you're a TikToker. I have nothing against TikTokers unless you're taking data, but I don't have any data on there now, except for mine. No, I was reading that I guess Oracle, like US, the White House, is talking to Oracle and US investors about taking over TikTok. That's an article that I'm reading on NPR, which I'm like okay, so like they're working on something, and, of course, it was definitely interesting. It was like right before Trump was taking office, it went down and all of a sudden, within 24 hours, boom, it's back up and it's thanks Trump, you know.

Olivia Yetman: 15:00

So I'm like there's a lot more going on here than probably realized but that's the political stuff probably, yeah, and I mean, yeah, you brought that up. So tiktok took themselves down. Like the government actually did not do that, they went black themselves so that they could pump back up and put that message up to the new president of the united states wow so and that is basically brown nosing, if you will um, so wait a minute, let me clarify.

Brian Curee: 15:38

You're saying that the government did not take tiktok down I mean they threatened to do it.

Olivia Yetman: 15:44

But but, but TikTok turned themselves off. Tiktok did their own blackout.

Brian Curee: 15:49

Yeah.

Ashton Curee: 15:50

Interesting. I haven't heard anything about that, so won't you think that's?

Olivia Yetman: 15:54

concerning. I think it's very concerning. So the other thing I find very concerning is them wanting a U S company to own it but then letting someone like Mark Zuckerberg buy it, because that is a monopoly, which is not again a good thing for anything, cause then he, this one person controls, all of you know, our social media platforms, and that's a slippery slope as well. I mean, elon owns x, but I mean who's even on that anyway? But like if they would allow that, that is very, very, very so let me read this.

Brian Curee: 16:42

So this way you know too. So I don't think that's the case. I think what's going on is they're forcing them, like they have to find someone else to handle the data, like some of that, like the control of it. So what this article says right here is says the Trump administration is working on a plan to save TikTok that involves tapping software company Oracle and a group of outside investors to effectively take control of the app's global operations. According to two people direct knowledge of the talks, under the deal now being negotiated by the White House, tiktok's China-based owner, bytedance, would retain a minority stake in the company, but the app's algorithm, data collection and software updates will be overseen by Oracle, which already provides the foundation of tiktok's web infrastructure. So that's a good sign there, I guess. Because like, yeah, I would agree.

Brian Curee: 17:35

Like if, if they open up doors where somebody like mark zuckerberg or somebody that could purchase it, that's not really helping. Like that's yeah, you're, you're creating a monopoly and there's already things there. If I'm gonna have to have another episode, probably soon, about zuckerberg and uh and meta and stuff, because the thing is like, if, if they did do that, we know that the thing about meta is we use all the platforms. We, you know it's a love hate relationship for a lot of people, uh, because that's where they've always been, but meta hasn't, I think, even though they've done a good job trying to. You remember the times where zuckerberg was looked at like some evil, like demon.

Brian Curee: 18:15

You know all his eyes are black and you know I think we've seen like a little like you've seen more than two, yeah, all, more than two, yeah, all of them and like like a little like, uh, like I had like little dinosaur arms. You remember that one, olivia, right, the picture was like yeah, but but think about it, I was just. I can't remember who it was. I was watching. It was a marketing guy and he was pointing out how they've done such a good job of humanizing zuckerberg. They he was not looked at as a human being, he's from another planet and all like over the last two years you've seen pictures and videos of him surfing with his wife. They've done a really good job humanizing him.

Brian Curee: 18:54

But people still have a trust issue with Meta. So if Meta bought out TikTok, it would be the end of it, because I think just the name people are going to be like no, it's going to have a bad taste in their mouth and just like you're saying you would not be. Would you stay on TikTok if? No, I didn't think so.

Olivia Yetman: 19:12

I mean I'm still on, you know, I still use his platforms, but you know like, yeah, that would not be okay with me at all so?

Ashton Curee: 19:25

so I know you just said that they took their own app down. Did they take it off the app stores too? Because you know, I don't know if it's available now, but you know, for a while you couldn't download it off the app store after the takedown happened. Was that apple and google backing off because they were scared, or did? Do you know if they ordered?

Olivia Yetman: 19:46

I don't know. All I've seen was that they were responsible for the blackout and very strategically came back up, for you know the message. But also what people didn't realize, which I was even more upset about, was CapCut is a TikTok product and I use CapCut every single day for work, so I was very upset about that.

Brian Curee: 20:15

And that took longer to come back. That was big. That was big. I was like what? Capcut's gone. I did not expect that either. Now, I could still use it, but I couldn't use any templates, anything like that. I could still edit it, but I couldn't use any templates, anything like that. I could still edit videos on here, but I couldn't use any of the other extra features on it, like templates, music, the internet accessible stuff.

Brian Curee: 20:34

Yeah, anything internet accessible. It was gone. To kind of answer your question about the App Store action, from my experience with working with apps, the app developer has an option to turn that off, so that's probably where they cut it. They probably said, hey, don't turn off the app in these countries I'm guessing that's what they did and then for it to come back. It does take time for Apple to say, just like when you upload a new page to a website, google has they'll decide when they're going to recrawl it and index it. So that's the same thing with the App Store. You have to wait. Sometimes it might be 24 hours or 48 hours. Uploading a podcast, if I update a podcast it's going to take so many hours before it goes across the whole board of all different platforms.

Ashton Curee: 21:21

It actually isn't up yet. As of what day is it? February 6th? It's not back on the Google App Store really interesting yeah, it actually says right here downloads for this app are paused due to current us legal requirements. Oh, man, we better check it see if it's on the look at what's at the top, only the next most popular replacement for tiktok oh yeah let's talk about that how it's not doing exactly what people.

Brian Curee: 21:55

Olivia, I did a search for TikTok in the Apple store and I don't see it.

Ashton Curee: 22:00

Yeah, I thought it had been taken down. I guess we'll have to do some research on it.

Olivia Yetman: 22:06

Oh, that's interesting.

Ashton Curee: 22:08

Is this breaking news.

Olivia Yetman: 22:11

When I search TikTok on my app store, the first thing that comes up is Instagram.

Brian Curee: 22:21

Do you even see TikTok? I don't even see TikTok right now.

Olivia Yetman: 22:23

No, you can only download the TikTok saver to save your old TikTok.

Ashton Curee: 22:29

So that's what I was talking about. I know, right during the initial like the initial blackout, they all came off the app stores and I thought I had seen something that said that apple and google because they're the biggest um app store holders they basically took it down on their own behalf and I didn't know in what level that happened. If Apple and Google did it, if TikTok did it, if the government ordered it, like, who's responsible for that?

Olivia Yetman: 23:02

Oh, that's very interesting.

Ashton Curee: 23:05

I don't imagine. I mean Google could say it's because of legal requirements and it's not actually, but I kind of find it unlikely.

Brian Curee: 23:12

Well, I mean, if there is a security risk and data transfer, those platforms don't want to be held responsible in any way. Like it's on their platform, right? This is like where we get to like, almost like, even though, like they don't own Apple store, they don't own the Google play store. You know, tiktok doesn't own it. It is a least on their side when it comes to a lease property. It's kind of like a website. Like I can host my website on a server, but that owner of that server can decide your website is not allowed on here and they can kick me off and I have to go find another server. The only thing here is tiktok has to find. Like they only have google play or apple. So they must have been the ones that said nope, you're not coming back on until whatever this security threat is handled.

Ashton Curee: 23:59

So the only thing I will say is, on that front, normally the distributor cannot really get in trouble Like, for example, google. If they put TikTok up normally from, from my understanding at least, they would not be able to get in trouble with that. There's actually a big situation right now in the 3D printing community where these websites are scared right now of putting up a certain file because of a big drama that happened, and they can only get in trouble if they actually are warned, and no warnings ever went out. So I don't know if the same ruling applies, but it looks like it's more to protect the distributor across most industries, unless they've been, like, warned specifically. I guess I could look it up, I guess, yeah, that would be public.

Brian Curee: 24:53

I guess my thing that I would say is this as a business owner, knowing there might be a risk, and how many people could come back and try to fight you for it, for allowing it back on your platform, I don't know. I think I'd hold off. So I mean taking it from that point of view, but I don't know. I mean, Olivia, what were you going to say?

Olivia Yetman: 25:16

Oh, I was going to say don't know. I mean, olivia, what were you gonna say? Oh, I was gonna say, uh, what do you think happened after the tiktok platform went down as well? What? What platform do you think surge?

Brian Curee: 25:27

uh, I would say x, but I know that there was okay, so I know there was a china based, which I'm like. This doesn't make any sense. What was it?

Olivia Yetman: 25:35

called red red red no and lemon eight and they're both chinese based. Yeah, and it was all.

Brian Curee: 25:42

So just to prove a point though, because, like the red one, it was all in chinese. You couldn't even yeah it was.

Olivia Yetman: 25:49

It is to prove a point, for sure, but one in eight, I think, is actually pretty valid and like a fun type of thing. But yeah, um, uh, yeah, so that that was just.

Brian Curee: 26:04

I mean it was funny, but I was like, well, you know, you just went ahead and downloaded an app that well, I guess if you get hacked, I mean it's on you. I'm like I'm not downloading any app that's in a language I cannot even understand. Forget that. I have a hard enough time understanding English. I'm not going to put something on. Definitely. I'm like is that an icon or is that a letter? I don't know, I can't figure it out, so I would click something. That would be really bad.

Olivia Yetman: 26:29

Well, it's a bunch of things that we're doing Exactly yeah.

Brian Curee: 26:33

I thought that was hilarious. I'm like what is this Like? Should we check it out? And then I found out it's in a whole different language. I'm like no, not checking it out. So what'd you find out, Ashton?

Ashton Curee: 26:43

It looks like there might have been a warning. I can't verify it right now, but it looks like that. They're in the public records, in Judy records. It looks like that there was a warning, but I'm Are you looking up, like the judge, judy records?

Brian Curee: 27:01

Is that what you're looking?

Ashton Curee: 27:01

up. No, there's a website called Judy records where you can look up United States court cases and all this public information. This is like this, gen Z stuff.

Brian Curee: 27:11

That's why he's like he knows all these different things to look at.

Brian Curee: 27:13

It's crazy.

Brian Curee: 27:15

But well, I mean, I think that you know, I guess my big concern is well, that's something that I want to be empathetic to, because I know there's a lot of people that do rely on TikTok for their business and, unfortunately, some of them are relying on their the total success of their business and, as we've talked about Olivia with clients and Ashton, that we have to be very careful of building on a lease property, because there is a very high risk on any lease property, not just TikTok on Facebook, on Instagram, it doesn't matter if it's US, if it's in China, whatever it is.

Brian Curee: 27:53

There are risks matter if it's us, if it's, if it's in china, whatever it is, there are risks and you have to be planning on a way to like, if you're going to use them, have a way to to move them to a property that you own, because if something happens just like this, like this blackout, and you lose everything what was the app vine that we've talked about several times over and over? Yeah, like, you lose all those connections if you're not planning for this. It's a lease property.

Ashton Curee: 28:17

You have to think beyond the lease property you got to move them to a property you own. You got to move them to something where you can keep connection with them? No, definitely. So what property are?

Brian Curee: 28:29

you going to move everybody to olivia, so what?

Olivia Yetman: 28:33

property? Are you going to move everybody to Olivia? Email is always going to be your tried and true thing to do. Right Email for sure.

Brian Curee: 28:45

Yeah, get them your email.

Ashton Curee: 28:51

Why?

Brian Curee: 28:52

don't we just start hosting forums?

Ashton Curee: 28:53

We need to buy a domain and make a forum. Buy a domain and make a forum.

Olivia Yetman: 28:55

Yeah, that's like really going back, do you remember? Do you consider texting owned?

Brian Curee: 28:59

property. Well, to be honest with you. So now we're getting an interesting conversation here because even I don't consider now this is me personally, I don't consider email or text messaging owned property. Well, where are you supposed to send them? Because, like, that's really kind of like. Here's the thing. It's like they are, I guess, kind of like you own the list, but those people can unsubscribe to your texts, to your emails. So those are more like permission-based, like you're asking them, hey, give me this information, they're giving it to you. That's like so valuable, but you can download that and save it somewhere. So you, you know you, so you kind of own it, it's like an in-between.

Olivia Yetman: 29:42

I guess like that's where you just want to handcuff everybody.

Brian Curee: 29:44

Handcuff everybody to my desk and a pole and just be like you're not going when I think about like own properties, I'm talking about like those are probably the biggest things. When you think of owned is like your website. You own that. So, like, if you're creating content, be putting that content on your own website that can be moved and put anywhere. Your own app Though you have to put it on at least servers. You can own your own server. So there are mixtures, but emails and all that are, yes, important to get.

Ashton Curee: 30:13

That's what you want to get I think what more qualifies it as a owned property is if you have the efforts, like you own your website. If your server, you know, gets blown up, you still have the data. Well, you should, you should follow the rule of thumb uh to local one cloud, but you have that data elsewhere, so that you can move your data to another server.

Ashton Curee: 30:37

Wait a minute two local, one cloud. What does that mean? The rule of thumb is, when you are doing anything that is data sensitive or really honestly anything, you have two local saves of said project and a cloud save. So usually one stays on you on a thumb drive, one stays on your laptop or computer you're working on, one stays in the cloud. So if your house burns down, well, you have a hard drive in your pocket and you have one in the cloud. Oh, if all the internet goes down or Google goes down and all that was in drive, you have two locals. You always have something there.

Brian Curee: 31:17

That's the rule of thumb, gotcha that makes sense and I think that you know, olivia, with what we're talking about, with owned and permission-based, I think what I think you're right like that is more owned, like you own that list, uh, it's just there's. I guess there's. I look at it as permission-based, as different ways you approach these, these technologies to own versus permission. But, yeah, you want to get their contact information, you want to store that somewhere, like you're saying. Ashton, that's a great point, the one you know. Whatever you said, one local.

Olivia Yetman: 31:46

Two locals, one cloud.

Brian Curee: 31:48

Two locals one cloud, so I should get this pair of shorts I really liked I should get two more pairs so I can keep one in the cloud, like on my patio, hanging, and then two more in my closet. Is that what you're saying?

Ashton Curee: 32:03

No, the two local one cloud would be you wearing one pair of shorts, you keeping one in the closet and then you send one to an Amazon warehouse for them to keep. That would be your two local one cloud. That's a good. I like that. I like that. I need to buy my own Amazon warehouse.

Brian Curee: 32:21

Well, I think that, olivia, I thought it was good to talk about this because I think there are some things that we don't really know what's going on, but being aware of the things that we do have control over and planning for if this happens again, Will we see more of this in 2025? There's a lot of stuff that's changing with privacy and data and all these different digital applications. So I think, yes, you can take the path of. I guess let me rephrase this we can take the path of, actually, ashton, you can edit that out. So here's my thoughts. How we react may or may not help the situation at all. So what we really have to be focused on is choosing. How are we preparing ourselves for those unknown, knowing that, again, these are lease properties? What is our plan? You cannot rely solely on that and just you know.

Brian Curee: 33:25

I think that one of the things that I wrote in my notes I heard a person say this, and I don't remember who it is. I'm terrible at writing down names. I did not write down this name, but one of the things I heard was people were going on and on about how it's a control thing Now, and people said I'm not going to be controlled, which I get, it. I'm like one of those people too. I don't want to be controlled. But this person said something and I was like, ooh, that's kind of interesting If you really think about this.

Brian Curee: 33:54

And it goes back to the spy museum, ashton. This person said, if you really think about it, everybody is being controlled by somebody. And he's like, if you think about the propaganda, if you're, you might be like oh, I can't believe they took tech talk away, or I can't believe they took this away now, but what fuels that? Is it an influencer that you're watching? Because you might say you're taking control, but that influencer is actually controlling you, to have you go down that way. And I'm like, ooh, that's really interesting things to be thinking a little bit deeper about, to be a little bit more mindful about. So I think that's a good place to end it. Unless Olivia or Ashton, you said no, it's not, I got something to say. What are your guys'?

Olivia Yetman: 34:38

thoughts I don't have anything. I'll probably get arrested if we keep going.

Brian Curee: 34:44

You're going to get blacked out yourself. Huh, you don't plan on going to.

Ashton Curee: 34:47

China anytime soon. Right, Because you should be fine.

Brian Curee: 34:57

No, I think that. Well, olivia, what would you say to everybody listening when it comes to comes to this situation and things to be thinking about in the future?

Olivia Yetman: 35:04

um, I think I would say that just with every single you know social media platform, ai, all of that. To just blame or skeptical of other countries is very not wise. Like again, because while we would think that a human couldn't do X, y and Z, history has shown us that there are people that even if you get a little taste of power, you can switch on a dime. So to just really again like, just keep your eyes open for everything, don't just be honed in on one certain thing, because that could be distracting you from the real thing. That's going on elsewhere, is my takeaway or advice yeah, that's good insight, that's good.

Brian Curee: 36:02

that's really good to be thinking about. So I want to encourage everybody. If you're listening to the podcast and you you like what you're hearing, you're more interested, like, well, what are some things I should be thinking of? Make sure you go visit kbdigitalcom. We have loads of articles on there. Olivia is always writing new things for the digital buzz and things to be like. She just wrote an article about predictions for social media in 2025. Go check that out. We have a lot of information on there that you guys can learn from. And if you enjoyed this episode, make sure you click follow and leave us a review. That helps us help other people find the podcast and we appreciate you guys listening and we would love to hear your thoughts. Make sure you click the text us a message in the show notes. Thanks for tuning in If you enjoyed this episode hit subscribe and leave us a review.