In 2017, france gave workers the right to ignore work communications outside of working hours. Should we adopt some kind of similar law? Put something into place? One person actually said you know, unfortunately this is the new norm and they don't really see a way out of it. And I said I understand what you're saying, but if we've noticed that something isn't healthy, should we just accept it because it's the norm? All right, welcome to this special episode of the Mindful Bites. If you just heard that noise, you're probably wondering what was that? That was confetti.

We were actually hosting a live podcast recording right here in the metaverse at the Killer Bee Studios. We'll be doing this once a month and during this podcast episode, we're going to be actually reading the fan mail that's coming in from some of the questions and thoughts we've asked for everybody's response for during the podcast throughout the month. So I want to first start off by apologizing for anybody that's listening to this episode, as I am a Gen Xer, which you're going to hear here in a minute. As everybody already knows, gen X is also, since we're older. I guess we kind of forget things and I forgot that this episode was supposed to be in the metaverse this week and reading the fan mail.

So I told everybody last episode that we were going to go deeper into how businesses and from the Entrepreneurs Magazine was talking about how seven businesses are using AI. So that will. We are going to cover that, but it won't be during this episode, so please don't click unfollow or leave us a bad review. Uh, but we will be covering it. Covering that. That episode will drop the first week of august, I believe. So if I'm wrong again, I'm sure the sassy millennial is gonna let me know oh yeah I will okay with that.

Let's go ahead and introduce ourselves. We'll start off with mad olivia I'm Olivia, your sassy savvy millennial.

Hey everybody, I'm Shawna and I am your Xenial digital dinosaur.

I'm Ashton, your Gen Z tech enthusiast.

And I'm Brian, your Gen X. Forget everything, business leader, except for I shouldn't forget clients and the things that we have to do right.

There's a lot of things you shouldn't forget.

Yeah, please don't.

Here's people listening to the podcast. You're going to have to understand that in the metaverse we have different names. We have Mrs Killer Bee, which is Shawna, mr Killer Bee, which is me, brian, but Olivia is Olivia, and Arcane Noman is actually Ashton, so we might call each other by different names in here and you're gonna be like who are these people? The same people, it's with metaverse avatar names. Let's go ahead. I know that you know we're going to be talking a little bit about generations today and I know, sauna, that's something that you wanted to bring in and discuss and then after that we're going to talk about. We're going to talk about some of the fan mail that's coming, some of the responses about people's thoughts and response to the law from France about the right to disconnect. So I'm really interested to talk about that. So, Shawna, speaking of generations, what did you want to talk about?

So we joke a lot about the differences in generations, especially on our panel, because we consider ourselves four different generations bringing different perspectives to all things technology and so I've been thinking a lot about that specifically because I've noticed how common it is now for people of different generations to either belittle other people in other generations or just to in general feel superior for one reason or another. So I was kind of thinking about that and reading articles about it and things like that and I found some really interesting information that I thought you guys would be interested in. So as I was thinking through it I realized that probably part of the problem is that that probably part of the problem is that you know older generations see the world changing so fast and see younger generations with different values and going about things in different ways and you know, probably also there's some fear there about what is going to happen in the future. You know young people in general are kind of more hopeful and looking forward to the future and feel better able to adapt to it. So I think that could be part of the problem. And then sometimes maybe younger generations are annoyed with how long it takes older people to adapt to things and, you know, be resistant to changes in technology. I mean, obviously you've seen that a lot in me. I'll resist all the technology if I can. But where the problem comes in is if we start to isolate ourselves from people of other ages, if you are degrading or belittling to other people. So that's kind of what I wanted to talk about was some ideas about how we can bridge the gap between generations, and so one of the ways is by avoiding generalizations.

So in our neighborhood there's this group of kids that just kind of wander around all the time. They play ball in the grassy areas and they, you know, go fishing, do all kinds of fun kid stuff. And I have heard both of these things. I have heard older people in our neighborhood say kids never go outside anymore, they just sit on their devices all day. And then I've also heard people say why are those kids outside all the time? Where are their parents? And it just kind of illustrated to me the humor of like nobody can ever do anything right. You know what you're doing some people are going to think is wrong for one reason, some people are going to think it's wrong for another reason. But it was just a funny thing to me when I heard people talking about this particular group of kids. But you know, avoiding generalization means that you don't say like Ashton was talking about this the other day. Ashton, what are some of the generalizations you've heard about Gen Z?

That we won't be a hardworking generation.

Olivia, what's a generalization? You've heard about millennials.

I agree even with Ashton, like millennials are lazy Wow.

So it's shocking to me because you know, we know and hang out with people of all generations and so you know I've seen firsthand, specifically in MetaLivia and Arcane, how hardworking they are and how creative. You know, I do feel like I've heard people say that about Gen Z like they're lazy and they're not. They're not hardworking. But the amazing thing that I've seen out of both of your generations different people in your generations is like unwillingness to just do things the way they've always been done, because you see better ways to do them quicker, more efficient. You know, more creative, and I think that's an amazing thing.

Well, I would say with a millennial. So that's Olivia, correct, olivia, you follow your millennials. So I mean, I remember all the pushback saying millennials don't do nothing, they're lazy. But you know, and from a Gen Xer, I would say that you know. From Gen X, I think people were like we're in boomers maybe, if they want to just get things done and go forward and and knock it out, which is a good thing and a and a bad thing at times as well.

But we've watched and witnessed millennials that, yes, they might be slower at making decisions but it seems like they're very good at processing before taking that step, which I've recognized. And with Gen Z, I recognize Gen Z more with Ashton I know you said this for both, but I see it a lot in Gen Zs probably even more, at least from my experience that Gen Zs aren't as quick as saying hey, I don't have to do things the way they've always been done. They're asking more questions, which I think is something that we're stepping into an era where we really need to be asking more questions across the board. But I like how you point out that these what did you call it Like? It's almost like a generational, like discrimination, almost.

Oh, I didn't call it that, but I like that. I think that's very accurate.

I think that is what it is, and it separates us. I mean, there's so much that we can learn from each other that this discrimination in generations actually prevents us from, I feel like, from evolving even further, because we can really learn so much from each other, like you were sharing how we can help each other out.

But that kind of leads me into the second way to bridge gaps in generations is by spending time with people in all generations, because it's a lot harder to have negative feelings about people if you actually spend time with them and hear their thoughts and hear the way they see the world and how they want to do things. So the third way is to mentor somebody, and this one's really exciting to me because it's not about older people mentoring younger people, it's about people of all ages mentoring people. So imagine this. Imagine if you're a person that's great at technology and you are understanding all of these new things that are coming up.

There's someone in your life who's older, who's feeling frustrated and overwhelmed and maybe even angry about the things of technology that they don't understand. You could help them, come alongside of them and say do you want to learn that? Do you want to learn about AI or do you want to learn about the metaverse? And then it's a beneficial relationship both ways, because they will start to see how you look at the world. You will learn from them and the wisdom of their age and you know it's a beautiful thing, and then we can start to bridge some of those gaps where right now I feel like, you know, people of different ages are pulling even further away from each other.

So, yes, that's what I just wanted to talk about. You know, when I started thinking through it and reading, I thought, you know, it would be really fun to talk to you all about it. People might have been confused that I called myself a Xennial, which is not a technical generation, but it is a micro generation in between X and millennial, because I was born in 1980. And, depending on whose numbers you're looking at, sometimes I fall in Gen X, sometimes I fall in millennial.

But I really actually don't want to identify.

You don't want to choose.

I don't actually fit into either one. That's why they created this micro generation is because it is a short little time where we kind of have a mix of both of those generations of the characteristics I want to say another good thing about different generations, so I'll start with you with Generation X.

I love about people with Generation from the Generation X like such a strong desire to like build something to make the world better to like, especially in business.

I could see that you know, a lot of the biggest businesses in the world right now were built by people from Generation X.

Had a desire like, grew up with a desire not to just possibly like go work at a factory or go, you know, do like following your parents' footsteps, but like build something new and great, and so I think that's a great thing about Generation X and millennials.

What I love and I see this a lot now on Instagram and things like that is how important you're taking mental health and you did not see that especially, let's say, 10, 20 years ago In our generations people didn't talk about it. If you said you're going to a therapist, people thought, oh gosh, you must be nuts. So I think that's such a healthy thing that you're bringing to the world and to the you know every other generation really and Generation Z. I love what I feel like I'm seeing in the workplace as your generation is coming into the workplace is like a willingness to push back against rules that are in place that don't make sense, or rules that maybe are there for, like the leader's convenience, but not necessarily best for business or for treating people the way they should be treated, and I think that's a beautiful thing too.

Can I point out? I know Olivia's got something she wants to add to it, but I do want to point out something that you just said there. You said how Gen Z's push back, and I think that's something that us Gen Xers, and really any generation, should really be paying attention to, because I feel like asking questions is received as more as pushing back. But I think we have to stop looking at it as that negative approach, because I mean I know you did not mean it negatively, but as a Gen.

Xer, we could take that as, like they're pushing back, they're against authority, disrespectful, disrespectful, disrespectful and that's not. I mean. You can go to that point. Sure, a lot of times I think it's. They're just, they're asking deeper questions that we probably even ourselves have been asking. We're ignoring, right, we're ignoring that. Go ahead, olivia.

Yeah, I was going to say positive with. You know, even with Gen X and adding boomers into that is their resilience and they so many I mean, that generate those generations were, um, they paved the way for the rest of us to be able to do what we do, right, Because they didn't have the technology or they went through a lot of tough situations. And so I think that is what is positive about them, is they really did pave the way for the rest of us to be able to do what we do.

That's beautiful.

Yeah, that's so true. And for a Xenial, I mean, I think it is a positive that you which I would say this about a millennial but is the fact that you have some of the old school mentality but also the new school mentality? I think it is a superpower to be able to have the best of both of those worlds and be able to adapt in both those ways. Oh yeah, and then Gen Z I feel like things change for them so quickly that I think it's really good again how they can adopt new things so quickly. A generation that is more open-minded than any other generation that we've seen and they care a ton about making the world a better place, which a lot of people are like. Oh my gosh, I'm scared that this person on their phone is going to be running the country, but I'm actually excited because I think that they have great hearts and they just don't get enough credit.

Yeah, I completely agree, and I love how thought. You see how well Olivia thought through that answer too Like that's a millennial. She really went deep into each one, and you can say something more about Gen X if you'd like.

I mean, I welcome it anytime you can call me, text me.

I have a phone, you can text me I do know, how to use text messaging.

You can page me.

Please page me, you could use the next style walkie-talkie.

Arcane, how about yourself? I try not to stereotype. I'm not good at saying your generation is good at that, your generation is good at that. Generation is good at that. Every generation has a place. Every previous generation gives a path for the new generation that's a very Gen?

Z answer.

I don't see. I don't see generations. I try not to use stereotypes that's a.

That's a beautiful Gen Z answer 100% something he said that I think ties it all together, though, is, he said, everyone has a place. Yes, that's a beautiful Gen Z. Answer A hundred percent.

Well, I mean, he said that, I think ties it all together, though, is he said everyone has a place. That's exactly the point. So nice job, ashton. I love that we were able to come on here and explain that at first. So for everybody that's already been listening to the podcast yes, we pick fun of each other because we're different generations and we have different perspectives. We have fun with it, but ultimately, all around here, we respect each other. We respect each other, we respect each other's views and input, and I think that's something that we want to encourage through Mindful Bites as well, as we continue to talk about tech and social media and business, and just our mental health as well.

And respect for the generations that are not, you know, reflected on this panel.

Yeah, I don't think boomers would ever be able to get on a headset, or maybe.

Oh, that's not true, do we?

have any boomers in the house? Any boomers in the house?

Oh, yeah, boomers right there, yes.

Yeah, welcome Bo yeah, representing the boomers right here. Yeah, welcome Bo yeah, representing the boomers right here. One of the things that we do here, one of the points of this episode segment of the Mindful Bytes, is we want to host it live once a month. It'll be the fourth Wednesday every month at 11 am here at Killer Bee Studios, and this is a time that we're going to bring in some of the feedback from our podcast. So, if you're listening to the podcast, we want to hear your input on the things that we're talking about. So all you do is look at the show notes and click that text me. You can text us a thought, a question, and then we'll bring it to this session right here of the Mindful Bites podcast. All right? So here's the question that I put out and that we had some feedback on. I wanted to bring it to the panel here for us to discuss.

Shana actually brought up during the last episode about the law that France put into place. So I did some research and I did find out that it was in 2017 when this law was put into place, and here's what the law is it's called the right to disconnect. Now, during that episode, we talked about how we, you know, with all the digital technology, it's hard to get away from work and stuff. It's almost like that's what's expected out of us. And in 2017, france gave workers the right to ignore work communications outside of working hours. This law was put into place to help employees truly disconnect after leaving the office.

So I put out a question, I asked people's feedback, like do you think that this is something that the U? So I put out a question and I asked people's feedback, like do you think that this is something that the US should adopt? Should we adopt some kind of similar law? Put something into place? Is it necessary? And I want to read some of the responses that I got. I want to hear your guys' input. So first, yeah, so first, here's one of the responses Great idea, great idea. I feel the pressure to respond to text or emails when it's from they feel the pressure to respond to text or emails when it's from their coworker, and that they've set boundaries on email, but still text, still comes in from time to time, which can frustrate them.

What are your guys' thoughts about that? I mean, yeah, I would be frustrated too, and it's hard when you try to set boundaries and then people don't respect them too, so I would be frustrated too. What?

do you guys think I mean, I think it's hard, I get what they're saying so to actually have more of an overarching law, I think would be great, because sometimes, even if you set boundaries I've noticed this If you give into it one time, then the person just thinks that the boundaries are gone for good, and so that's what gets frustrating as well. Good point.

You know, I actually, you know, coming from the business leader perspective when I received that message, one of my thoughts were was I've probably sent some of those texts out and I've been on the other side too, where I've gotten frustrated because people are texting me after hours and what I responded to this individual was saying I had to learn that, I had to learn for myself that a simple text to someone off hours could be saying something that me, as a business leader, never intended to say. I might work later in some of the later hours and I might send a message out and not thinking that they're going to receive it as oh man, it's not what I'm saying without receive it as oh man, like it's not like it, what I'm saying without saying it is I don't value your time. So I think any business leaders listening to the podcast take that into consideration. With people that are that are your team members, your employees, like, I don't think we mean it always in a bad way. I'm sure there are some that do.

Oh yeah, there's no doubt that there are plenty of bosses that are expecting people to be reachable all the time. But you know, olivia read something to us in the last episode that said it was about a leader who you know.

Someone had just started.

Remember talking about that, olivia, and he wrote in the email please don't feel the need to answer right now. This is when I work the best, but please respond when you work the best, that's. I think it comes down to communication. Like, if you're texting someone when it's not their work time, that automatically is going to take their mind back into work time, so that's disrespectful. An email you know they have to make their own choice if they're going to read their email or not. An email you know they have to make their own choice if they're going to read their email or not. But if you tell them I don't expect you to answer this until you're working. That clears up any sort of expectation that you know that they may have or you may have. It all comes down to communication.

Yeah, that's actually interesting because I had someone else that wrote back and they said that they feel like it's necessary, that a work-life balance is a term that is overused but still useful. We use that term a lot but I don't think we follow that term really as well as we could. And they said I don't like the fact that it needs to be regulated. Common sense should dictate it. We already know that by common sense that we shouldn't do that, and I pointed out. I was like well, common sense isn't as common today. Unfortunately, I don't think that it seems like it's something easy to be like yeah, that's common sense, but I don't think the technology has become made us, made us so accessible that I don't think it's even a common sense issue as much as I don't think, it's just the technology has made it so easily accessible to reach out to each other that we don't take into account that, hey, this is an individual person, that life does not revolve around this job, and it shouldn't.

Even a good leader should know that their team members' lives. They have lives outside of work, they have families that they're taking care of, they have children, they have friends, you know, and we have to be respectful of that, because when we send those messages, or we expect them to respond from a text message or a email after hours, we're actually coming in between them and their family too, which is not good.

Yeah, I think saying that you have to use your common sense is really an oversimplification, because there's a lot of things at play. There can be power dynamics. A employee can feel like if they're not accessible then they'll just get replaced. So there's all sorts of insecurity there about keeping your job. Or maybe they're trying to be promoted, so they feel like they have to really go the extra mile, and there's all sorts of things that play. So it can't come down to common sense. If you know you feel the pressure to do this for a multiple you know, for multiple reasons.

The thing with common sense is also, people have different definition of work life balance. Like for someone else, they could be, you know, a workaholic and their work-life balance is I only work 60 hours this week versus you know the 70 I usually work, or whatever, so that it kind of makes it tough. But I also think that there are careers where you know what you're getting yourself into. In regards to that. For example, if you're like a doctor or a surgeon, you have the expectation that you have to be on call sometimes, or even lawyers on call sometimes, or even lawyers, because if they have to prep for a case, you have to work those extra, communicate at odd times or whatever, because you have to be, in court.

So but for I think also and this is not, I don't think it's stereotyping generations, but maybe it is but I feel like, you know, gen X comes from a different working mentality, where you have to work 40 hours a week or you didn't accomplish everything that you possibly could have, and that's just not the case anymore with technology and all those different things yeah.

Well, I think that you touched on something there that I think is important With this individual. I responded back to him and asked him further, like because they made a mention about setting boundaries, and I'm like I think that's great. Boundaries should be set and respected on both sides, like even right now. Like Boundaries should be set and respected on both sides, even right now. We use Slack and one of our team members is in Finland and I can see now which I love this on Slack it tells me what time it is and it's like seven hours difference.

And I actually reached out to him and I said hey, just want to make sure, do you have your notifications turned off during evening hours, because I'm going to be messaging you and it's way later for you and I want to make sure it's not interrupting because they have a new baby. It's like being mindful of their whole real life situation outside of work. And he said, yes, I have them silenced and stuff, but he was very appreciative of that. And Olivia, I've messaged Olivia before and said don't respond to this tonight, don't respond to this. And she knows that I'll send messages just because they come to my thought, and if I don't put it in Slack. I don't text them to her. We've also put tools into place that don't interfere. A personal text should be something that's really important. Where do you draw the line on that?

I guess Even as different jobs, like, for instance Olivia, you do a lot with social media, so I know that's a big deal. I mean, as I've, you know, grown in, the landscape of social has changed. I think that people's expectations on messages have kind of changed as well, because and this is going into a little bit more of strategy but, like a lot of businesses don't even respond Right. So if you even get a response to a message 24 hours later, like that's still a big deal for people, so why put that pressure on yourself to be answering a message at 10 pm when you know you'll get the same result if you do it the next day at 9 am or whatever?

it may be. So I have changed on that, because I used to say social media is like being a doctor you are on call 24 to 7. It definitely doesn is like being a doctor you are on call 24 7.

It definitely doesn't pay like a doctor, no, and it's not a life or death situation either so well and, to be honest with you, if a bad response on social media is like going to put your business out of business, your business probably already isn't in a good place yeah that's not a good place to be.

Uh, because if you have a good you have good loyalty audience that trusts you, they're actually going to speak up for you too. So I agree too Like that's where I used to be like you would think like we have to respond right now, but when, in reality of it, you really don't. I wanted to hear your thoughts on it, so I'm glad to hear that and I think that that's it. We have to set boundaries. One of the things that I talked about with this individual was setting expectations from the beginning, from the start. If someone's applying for this job, can we set those expectations and then, if we have to change them, have a meeting and discuss that and see how that's going to affect each individual, Because you might have to make a decision. Not that we're making this change, but let's talk about this is an issue that we're trying to resolve. We feel like we need to be more available. What does that look like? How is that going to affect us in real life as well, and outside of the work hours? Those are important conversations I think we have to be open to having and I think Gen Zs are probably really good at that because, again, they're I mean even with Ashton. We know Ashton has told us himself at jobs I don't need to do this. They're looking at new paths and looking at being open to changing.

I would like to ask people that's listening let us know what kind of boundaries would you recommend to put into place. Use that right there in the show notes, just click that, text us, let us know your thoughts. What defines an emergency in your work field? One person actually said well, here's the thing is that this is the new norm. Unfortunately, this is the new norm and they don't really see a way out of it. And I said I understand what you're saying, but if we've noticed that something isn't healthy, should we just accept it because it's the norm? Should we?

bigger problem that a person can't necessarily solve all by themselves if they feel like their job's on the line. So I don't want to be insensitive to the fact that there are plenty of people out there barely making it financially, and so if they just decide one day like this isn't okay anymore, it's not good for me. That you know I can be reached all the time. I'm going to put an end to it, and then they might lose their job, and so it's just a complicated issue. So while I think, like in an ideal world, this shouldn't happen, people shouldn't allow it. Yes, it comes down to boundaries, but there are a lot of people in a position where they might not feel like they can set that boundary.

That's why I feel like they feel trapped, like you know. I would encourage people like I really hope that any business leaders listening to this podcast will take this into a real, real deep thoughts about you know, really think about this in your team, because if your team is running based off of fear, that team is never going to run to the capacity that it could, which is not going to help your business. Your team needs to be able to feel like a safe place that they can come and share these you know what they're really dealing with in these areas so your team can work better together. I think helping us all understand how this affects us because I mean those text messages and those emails can affect us on a mental health side especially if you feel like you're.

if you're doing this because out of fear you're going to lose your job. That's just such an unhealthy place to be and it's not good for either side. Did you have something, olivia?

Yeah, no, I totally agree with what Shawna was saying. Like it's a scary thing. But also for me I which I've gotten a lot better about this is like comparing myself to someone else. So I'm like if they're getting in the text and they're responding, that's gonna make me look bad and I am a good employee, blah, blah, blah. So again it does come out of fear again of looking bad. But what I've also come to terms with is you need as leaders and upper management in your company.

You're not doing yourself any favors by like running your employees ragged, because I always think of like you can't pour from an empty cup and you're not getting your best work from them if you don't let them fully disconnect. Like my friend and I started doing a thing because we've been in work mode and we were like, well, we sat for two hours straight, like that's ridiculous. So we text each other and say let's go for a 10 minute walk and we've noticed that even that 10 minute walk, we come back and we're like, whoa, that problem, I was thinking about it just hit me. So again, if you're not letting people relax their minds, you're not getting your best work from them either.

Yes, that's such an important point that's what we talked about in a past episode was the importance of rest for your mind. It starts to make connections and you're better at problem solving. I love that.

I love it. I do want to go ahead and cover one more before we wrap up, because I had one more person that responded and I thought this is a good place to close up this. This person responded back and said we could also, you know, have a personal, have personal boundaries and not respond because we aren't paid to work after hours, which is some of the things we're talking about. I'm like that is so true because I mean, as we mentioned during that episode, I said well, I don't want to pay you 24 seven, so I don't expect you to be available 24 seven. I also don't want to buy you different phones and stuff like that. They said that culture doesn't need to be legislated, and I see exactly where they're coming from and I agree to that too. I hate to have to put a regulation in. We, as humans, should be able to step back and really look at the bigger picture here and look at the problems that we're seeing burnout and all these things happening. I mean even with when people were able to start working from home, more remote, they've had several reports that come out that show that people are working more hours than they did before working from home. That's a fact it's on the what is it? Statista and all that. We've looked up those numbers and is that okay? I don't think it is. I think we really need to be aware of that and wonder look at this situation in your employees and look at maybe why they're feeling stressed, overwhelmed.

But they said this the culture doesn't need to be legislated. Boundaries are ours to set. Even if you're in a tough place, if you're in a work environment that you don't feel like you can, you have to really look and evaluate yourself and say is this healthy for me? It's not about going and quitting your job, hopefully. Go talk to your leadership, talk to them, be open, see how they respond. Because if you're working Now, this is just me, but if I'm working for somebody and I've got the nickname of being a maverick, but if I'm working with someone that doesn't respect that and understand that from my health, then I'm going to start making an exit plan, like, okay, I've got to find somewhere where they do respect me as a human. And I do feel like we are seeing that with younger generations, like Gen Zs and stuff, they're being very cautious and millennials about that type of work environment.

But they said this at the end. No corporation can mandate that you have to do this. This is what I love the most. We got to keep helping people see the possibilities, and that's what I love about what we're doing here in the Mindful Bites podcast. The whole thing is we don't have all the answers, but we're trying to help us become more aware, be more mindful of how technology, and even our actions from these technologies, are affecting each other's lives. So with that, I want to thank everybody for tuning in to this episode of the podcast. Make sure you, if you want to send us some fan mail. We'd love to hear your thoughts on our discussions and if you enjoyed today's episode, don't forget to click follow and leave us a review.